Tag Archives: Helpful

Bad experience with a local guide in Salta

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Well, we’re back in Buenos Aires after a week in the Northwest of Argentina (Salta and Jujuy provinces).  Jen is working on a post that will give a full overview of our trip with pictures and so forth, so we should get that up in the next day or so.  In the mean time, my priority has been writing a strongly worded post for Trip Advisor regarding the unpleasant experience we had with a guide named Angie that we contracted with in Salta in an effort to help save others from going through what we went through.

To keep you up to date on what we’ve been up to and to provide you with a strong warning in the event that you find yourself planning a trip to Salta you should definitely check out the post along with whatever responses may come from it here at Trip Advisor.  Below is my original post if you’d rather read it here:

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Title: Different point of view on popular Salta Guide

My wife and I just spent a week in Salta/Jujuy during which we used Angie’s (also known as Giena on Trip Advisor) services as a private guide for the first 3 days. We were extremely disappointed with the quality of her service, her incredible prices and her attitude towards customer service in general. I recognize that she is quite popular here on TA and receives volumes of positive feedback (which is how we found her to begin with), but after our experience with her, I have trouble understanding all of the praise and think it’s very important that TA has a post representing an alternative viewpoint so that other people have a more balanced idea of what Angie offers–had there been a post like this, we would likely have planned differently and had a much better trip. For context, we’re from the US and have been living in BsAs for the last 2.5 months; in that time we’ve developed a good understanding of pricing/cost of living in BsAs (this will be important when I discuss Angie’s pricing).

We hired Angie because of the great things we had read on TA. Unfortunately, due to a series of vague emails, we misunderstood her pricing to be US$250 for 5 days, when in reality it was US$250 PER DAY. We take partial responsibility for not having reconfirmed the total price, but after re-reading the email chain several times, there is definitely room for misinterpretation – Angie never stated it was a per day price nor did she provide a total price for the trip. Further, given our reference points for pricing in BsAs, it would never have ocurred to us that she could possibly charge US$250/day–I’ll get into that more in a bit. Had Angie not handled the misunderstanding so poorly, I would not be taking the time to write this detailed post–as it is, she left us feeling cheated and extremely unhappy.

In the end, we paid her US$500, which we feel was far more than she was worth. What did we get for our US$500? Here is what Angie did for us:

Day 1: 10am-3pm =~5 hours of time together including lunch (~3.5 hours of driving)

Angie picked us up at 10am and drove us to Cafayate with a couple of photo stops at well marked locations right along the side of the main road (e.g., Garganta del Diablo). We arrived in Cafayate at ~1pm and had lunch with Angie at her favorite restaurant in town. Then she dropped us off at our hotel at 3pm or so, and we didn’t see her again until the next morning.

Day 2: 10am-12pm ~2 hours of time together

We weren’t planning to see Angie on Day 2 (assuming that we weren’t paying for her) as we had told her we were planning to explore Cafayate by ourselves, but she told us she’d pick us up at 10am and take us to a couple of wineries so we reluctantly agreed.

She picked us up at 10am, took us to the goat cheese farm and then 2 wineries (each obvious tourist destinations). At each of these 3 venues she handed us off for the standard tour and waited until we were done. My wife had talked to her 2 days previously about setting up a lunch at the last winery and assumed this had been arranged. However, on the way there Angie pulled off the road, called the winery and then told us we couldn’t have lunch there because we didn’t book it the day before (I guess that was our job?). After the 2nd winery she dropped us off in town at ~12:00pm. The only other time we saw her that day was when she picked us up at our hotel and dropped us off at a restaurant for dinner (~10 min).

Day 3: 10am-2:00pm ~4 hours of time together (all driving)

She picked us up at 10am and we drove directly back to Salta on the same road we came down on with 2 stops at different photo spots. At this point, we still didn’t have a hotel booked for Friday night, and rather than helping us book something she just told us to let her know if we had trouble finding something. When we got back to Salta and she asked us for some money in advance is when we first realized that there was a significant misunderstanding over her pricing and that it was actually 4x higher than we had thought. US$250 per day was way beyond what we wanted to pay, so after talking it over that afternoon we told her that we could no longer work with her.

In summary, Angie spent maybe 11-12 hours with us over 3 days, primarily as a very highly paid taxi driver. She booked only one hotel for us (which was mediocre), she recommended a few restaurants in Salta (which were not particularly good and literally had large tour buses waiting out front as their tour groups dined there) and a couple of restaurants in Cafayate–one of which was good (though easily findable on the main square), the other was not. And for that, she demanded that we pay her US$500 despite the mixup what was at least partly her fault (according to her this was a great deal and we were ‘ridiculous’ to have thought she charged less); she had wanted US$1000 for 5 “days” (and yes, 2-4 hours of driving counts as a day according to her). Keep in mind, these prices do not include food, hotels or any activities for you and that Angie told us several times that she never has to pay in restaurants or hotels when on tours, so I’d think her only real cost is her car and fuel.

Also, despite other posters with very positive comments about learning about the history of the region and other local-type info from Angie, we did not have this experience with her at all–her favorite topic of conversation was how much better off we would be if we switched to her preferred hotel in Cafayate (this awkwardly came up at least 6 times, leading us to wonder why it was so important to her). In general, we do not feel that we saw, heard, did, or learned anything in our time with Angie that we couldn’t have easily experienced on our own. We ultimately paid her what she demanded; we probably shouldn’t have.

Aside from the mixup we had, we genuinely feel that US$250/day is an outrageous price for these services, even if they were great. After living in Buenos Aires for 2.5 months, here is some context on what you can get for US$1000 in the capital (which should be significantly more expensive than the provinces):

-1 month rent in a nicely furnished apartment in Recoleta or Palermo with all utilities included plus weekly maid service (we pay $1200/month for a massive and luxurious place)

-15+ fantastic dinners for 2 at the very nicest restaurants in BsAs with great wine/steak/etc.

-6 weeks of 20 hours/week Spanish school at one of the best schools (or ~70 hours of private instruction from a highly qualified teacher)

-1500+ empanadas (seriously)

-80 bottles of very good Argentine wine purchased in Salta (or 150 bottles of the exact same wine if you buy it in BsAs–Salta is much more expensive even for the local wines, not sure why)

-For AR$600 = ~US$155 for the 2 of us, we spent a full day (9am-7pm) in Tigre with 2 wonderful guides that spoke perfect English, gave us lunch, took us kayaking for 3.5 hours way off the beaten path and then served us an incredible asado with 4+ courses of meats. It was an all-day event, we saw and did things we couldn’t have possibly done on our own, we learned tons of things about Argentine culture and the Tigre Delta, it came with great food and it was reasonably priced. Again, BsAs/Tigre should be more expensive than Salta.

For some further context on how much an income of US$250/day is in Argentina, we’ve heard from many friends in BsAs that a high paying job in the capital (e.g., computer engineer) will pay ~AR$8000/month, which is ~US$100/day for 8+ hour days.

To be fair, I don’t know if Angie’s prices are especially high or if they are normal for private guides in Salta. Either way, for US$250 per day, I would expect MUCH, MUCH more for my money, so my first recommendation would be to do it without a guide as visiting the NW is really quite straight-forward (e.g., pretty much everything is on the main road and well marked). If for some reason you feel like you’d like to have a guide, I would shop around and be very explicit about what your expectations are (e.g., I want to see things off the beaten path and experience things beyond what the tour buses do, etc.). If your highly-paid private guide is taking you to the same places the large tour buses go, you’re better off without them.

For the last 2 days of our trip, we rented a nice car from a company with fluent English speakers (Alamo), saw everything that we would have seen otherwise, enjoyed the freedom of exploring on our own, and spent far less than half of what it would have cost to continue with Angie. This took less than 2 hours of planning/setup and could have been done even more cheaply with some advance planning.

Sorry to be so negative, wish things hadn’t gone this way. Obviously many other people have enjoyed their experiences with Angie, so possibly this is a one-off, but I think an important data point for people to consider in planning their trips. Let me know if you have questions either through the forum or through PM and I’ll be happy to provide more detail.

Ryan

Vacation #2 . . . via 20-hr. bus ride???

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After hearing so many great things about Salta and the northwest of Argentina, we’re off this evening to check it out for ourselves.   Planning the trip has been fun so far – we’re hoping it pays off when we get there.  More to come, but in the meantime, here are a couple of thoughts on the major parts of trip-planning so far:

Decision #1: How do we get there?

The two options are flying or taking a bus.  Our default would normally be to fly, but after our last experience flying with Aerolineas Argentinas, we’re open-minded about other transportation options.  We’ve vowed to avoid Aerolineas whenever possible, and flights on LAN (the only other carrier covering the route) would have cost us almost as much as our monthly rent.  Which leaves the bus.

Map of Argentina image

Going to Salta is like crossing the entire country of Uruguay . . . 3 times

Now, you may not realize that Argentina is big.  Really big (see map).  We’re about halfway down the east border of the country, and we’re going to the far northwest.  That’s a long way.  Hence, it takes ~20 hours to get there from Buenos Aires.  Yep, that’s almost a full day.  We board at 6pm tonight and get in sometime around 1 or 2 in the afternoon tomorrow.

Apparently, bus travel is great in Argentina.  They have numerous classes of service, including the “cama suite” that we opted for – supposedly seats that lie completely flat, have full curtains and includes all your meals (and wine with dinner – yay!).  So we’re giving it a shot – will let you know what we think on the other end.

Decision #2: On our own or with a guide?

Turns out that a lot of the stuff you go to Salta to see isn’t really in Salta.  It’s an amazing region with incredible landscapes and natural wonders, but they’re all spread out and all take a full day to visit.  So our choices were to (1) rent a car (crazy expensive), (2) join a bus full of tourists (could be fine but we’ve heard it feels a lot like cattle herding for the Salta tours) or (3) hire a private guide to take us around for a few days.  After reading unanimously positive reviews about one particular guide in the area, we decided to book her.  We’ve had a bit of trouble connecting on email so don’t really know what our itinerary with her is going to be, but we’re trusting all the good reviews on tripadvisor and hoping she’s booked our hotel for us by the time we arrive (after the aforementioned 20-hr. bus ride – think we’ll be excited for a room and a shower by that point).

Wish us luck on our epic bus journey – we’ll post more from Salta!

Dear Aerolineas Argentina…

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Dear Aerolineas Argentina,

You let us down.

I’m writing to express my extreme disappointment that our ticket purchasing experience was so anticlimactic. You may think that we had unreasonably high expectations, but I think you’d have to admit that it was you that raised our expectations by leading us on so tantalizingly in the early stages of the process.

We began shopping for a ticket on your website with a few mild concerns based on having read poor reviews from other travellers, but we were willing to look past those reviews and give you a chance–especially since you were ~$200 cheaper than LAN for our flights to Iguazu. We found a schedule that worked for us and proceeded to make the reservation through your website. Up until then, we thought of you as just another airline and assumed that buying tickets from you would be just like so many other online tickets we’ve purchased before. That was when you first began to tease us…

It seemed strange that we received a confirmation page including seat assignments without ever having been asked to pay for the tickets. We did notice the small print near the bottom that said that we were required to pay within 24 hours and would receive instructions for how to do so in an email. This seemed odd, but we were willing to go with it. However, the email you sent us said this:

Aerolineas_Argentina_Payment_Email_Confirmation Image

Don't you want us to pay??

We weren’t so excited about calling you to ask how to pay, so instead we did some searching around your website and encountered several sets of instructions clearly indicating that we could and should pay online; however, there was nowhere on your website that actually allowed us to do so.

Aerolineas_Argentina_Payment_Instructions Image

These instructions are really thorough and helpful... though, if one were being picky, one could argue that if you are going to write detailed instructions, it may be better if the feature actually existed. Sorry if this is culturally insensitive.

Google, TripAdvisor and the local expat blog also seemed to be at a loss for how to proceed. This is when our expectations started to go up–it seemed clear that this was going to be far more exciting than just another ticket purchasing experience. We decided to wait until the next day and ask around at our school to see if any of the locals had encountered this before and were told that despite what your website says, foreigners are in fact required to pay by telephone. We were told that that this has something to do with security to minimize potential for chargebacks (see handy diagram below); but since that clearly doesn’t make any sense at all, my guess is that you just want to have the opportunity to speak live to those of us that are lucky enough to pay at least double your normal prices to thank us (for those of you keeping score at home, it is true that there is massively different price for locals vs. Foriegners)…

Credit Card Chargeback Diagram Image

I bolded the differences for anyone with the mistaken impression that these processes are similar

Before we called, we only expected to be on hold for awhile and then go through the annoying hassle of giving you all of our credit card info over the phone with a language barrier and nothing more (which obviously we were pretty excited about), but we had no idea what you had in store for us… I can’t convey to you in words how flattered and excited we were when you told us that because the flights were within 48 hours, we would not be able to pay for them over the phone either, but would instead need to go to one of your local offices and pay in person. It was a nice touch that you offered us the alternative of paying at the airport the day of the flights as long as we got there by 3pm (for a 7:45pm flight)–clearly an attractive option.

In fact, we were so excited that we called one of our local friends and asked if he would be willing to call you back with us on a conference call just to make sure that you weren’t giving us any unnecessary “special” treatment; after reconfirming with our friends help, we spent a few minutes basking in the joy of having the opportunity to meet you in person and then got ready to go. At this point, we had given up predicting what new twists and turns the story would take, but we had no doubts that you would have several more surprises in store for us, so we brought multiple forms of identification, a few different credit cards and a decent amount of cash just in case.

After having read about how frequently people get pick-pocketed in the subway, we were particularly excited to have our passports and other valuables with us for the lengthy ride to the end of the D line smack in the middle of rush hour. Being pressed up against the glass for the majority of the ride while trying to keep our belongings with us served to build the suspense higher and higher.

Crowded subway image

If Argentines were Asian, it might have looked like this

We were at a fever pitch when we arrived at your office and completely ready to experience Crazy Town, AR. BUT, this is where you let us down on several dimensions:

1) There was not even a line, we walked in and were waved directly over to an agent.

2) The agent immediately understood why we were there and was able to process the transaction in under 2 minutes. She then gave us a receipt that we were supposed to bring over to the cashier for payment, so our hopes went up again…

3) Only to be dashed by a <30 second conversation to make the payment with the cashier.

So, in less than 3 minutes we had paid for our tickets and were all set. There was no chaos, there was no demanding of 4+ forms of ID (or any ID at all ironically), there were no language barriers, no 2 hour waits, nothing. You built up these huge expectations for us and then just ruined it all by suddenly being efficient.

You can imagine our disappointment.  If for some reason you can not imagine our disappointment, please refer to the diagram below:

Excitement_Over_Time Image

Please contact me with any questions

Hopefully you can provide us with a more consistent experience next time.

Regretfully yours,

Ryan and Jen

P.S. After thinking through all of our experiences with you thus far, I think I may have figured out how you operate. While many businesses strive to meet or exceed customer expectations, from the 5 examples below, it seems that your customer strategy is simply to do the opposite of what customers expect in every situation. As a former strategy consultant, I for one applaud this boldly differentiated approach to making sure your customers never get bored with you.

Example 1: Trying to purchase ticket online

Our expectation: Just put in credit card info and make purchase

Aerolineas Argentina: State frequently on your site that it is possible to pay online, but instead make it impossible to pay online.

Example 2: Calling to purchase ticket

Our expectation: A mild hassle, but at least we can finalize the purchase

Aerolineas Argentina: Tell us that we have to go to the office to make the purchase

Example 3: Going to office to finalize purchase

Our expectation: A major hassle with low probability of success

Aerolineas Argentina: Super smooth and efficient process

Example 4: Rationale for making us go to the office in person within 48 hours of flight

Our expectation: Something to do with a higher degree of security?

Aerolineas Argentina: Did not check our ID or even look to see if our signature matched the credit card we used

Example: Onboard flight to Iguazu

Our expectation: We may be late, but we’ll get to Iguazu

Aerolineas Argentina: Instead, land in a different city (Posadas) and don’t tell us until we land

P.P.S After reviewing the schedule change email you sent us the day after our flight left, I am further convinced of the above

Aerolineas_Argentina_Schedule_Change_Notification Image

You can't make this up

How can you add your signature to a PDF for free (without printing and scanning)?

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Another question that needed answering…

I was planning to finish up a post on our wonderful experience with Aerolineas Argentina this evening, but instead got to spend some quality time figuring out the answer to the above question (thanks IRS for taking 4 months to get back to me on my 2006 taxes!).  Anyway, those of you that hang out in offices all the time won’t have much need for this tip, but in the event that you ever do need to sign a PDF and email it back to someone while on the road, here is an excellent tutorial I came across via google (which references some great and easy to get free software):

How To Add Your Signature to PDFs For Free

My thanks to the original author!

Our first vacation from vacation: Iguazu Falls

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Just got back from 3-days in Iguazu falls and didn’t want to pay the AR$60/day for internet access at our hotel, so apologies for the lack of posting lately.

Awesome trip!  Iguazu is truly spectacular.  We stayed in the Sheraton which is the only hotel in the park itself on the Argentina side and it was phenomenal.  Plus, we stayed there on Starwood points, so it was a very cheap trip (thanks consulting!).  We’ll write a more thorough review of the trip in the days to come, but in the mean time, here’s lots of pictures:  Iguazu Pictures Enjoy!

p.s., it’s pretty wild to return home from a vacation and not dread going back to our regular lives… all of you out there that are still consultants, take note!!

How to find a Spanish school in Buenos Aires (we love ours!)

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One of the major reasons we wanted to come to Buenos Aires was to learn Spanish.  We didn’t realize at the time that Argentine Spanish is a bit, shall we say, special – they use “vos” instead of “tu” to mean “you”, and they pronounce everything with a lovely Italian-sounding accent (you may be familiar with the word “pollo” – pronounced “poyo” through most of the Spanish speaking world but “posho” in Argentina).  So, it’s not exactly your standard Spanish, but it’s lovely just the same and we were super excited to start studying.

After a few days settling in to Buenos Aires, we started our search for a Spanish school.  There are well over a dozen different schools here in Buenos Aires, most located in or near the center of the city.  The standard schedule is 20 hours a week, typically with classes running ~9am to 1pm-ish, and the schools usually have classes at various levels running each week.  Prices range from $150-200USD/week, and pretty much every school offers a small discount for paying for multiple weeks upfront.

We started our search by reading through posts on the various BA expat blogs and google searches.  We found a few schools to visit that were recommended and had decent prices – we wanted to check them out in person, and Ryan needed to take the placement test (pretty much every school has you take a placement test if you’ve ever studied Spanish so they can place you in the right class for your level – go figure).  We decided to visit IBL, expanish and Vamos Spanish.  Here’s our quick takeaway on each:

  • IBL: Located in a cool old building turned into a shopping arcade and office building on busy pedestrian Florida Street.  Let’s just say that we weren’t in the best mood after battling the crowds on the street to get to the building.  The school is located on an upper floor in the building with an enclosed patio area used for breaks and for a smoking area.  The staff (which seemed to be mostly locals) was friendly and said most classes had ~5 students.  Overall, the school was fine but didn’t particularly wow us, and we weren’t excited about the daily rush-hour subway commute to get there.  Cost: $175/week.
  • expanish: Definitely the busiest and most commercial of the schools we visited, expanish is a volume operation.  They have great marketing and a bustling space with a central “living room” area (they’re strangely proud of the countless pictures of students sleeping on their couches that are plastered all over the walls – we’re not sure exactly what’s up with that).  There were at least 15 students/prospective students hanging out in the common area while we were there.  The school offers the standard 20 hr/week class schedule and is also located downtown-ish, just off the massive 9 de Julio street.  We got the sense that this is the choice for backpackers and younger, single crowd looking to meet other independent travelers through classes. Cost: $160/week.
  • Vamos Spanish: We wanted to visit this school because it was pretty much the only one we found in Palermo, walking distance from where we were living.  The school occupies its own antique building, with a common room on the ground floor and classrooms upstairs.  It’s a smaller school than the others we visited, typically with 10-15 students in a given week.  The mostly-foreign support staff is very friendly, and we got a good vibe that the experience was a bit more personalized here than the other schools we visited.  Cost: $160/week.

We decided to go with Vamos (partly because we really liked the feel of it and partly due to location) and have loved our experience so far.  We’ve spent more than 80 hours each in class (we’re in the running for the title of longest-running students ever!) and have learned a ton over that period of time.  Class sizes are small – my classes have each been 1-4 students (including one week where no other students were at my level, so I got private one-on-ones with my teacher), and the curriculum is customized.  The teachers adapt the topics covered and the materials used based on the needs of the specific students in the class, unlike other schools that follow a fixed teaching plan (e.g., colors day 1, telling time day 2, etc.).  The school develops its own teaching materials, and we’ve found that the teachers are great at finding the right exercise to help with your confusion over este vs. esto vs. esta or correct use of direct object pronouns.  As you might guess from our backgrounds, we’ve both been through quite a few classes and educational programs at top schools, and we’re both very impressed with the teaching style and talent of our teachers at Vamos.

Outside of the classroom, Vamos puts a lot of effort into offering additional activities to its students.  These range from practical post-class “workshops” (e.g., how to recognize and prevent getting stuck with counterfeit bills, how to navigate the crazy BA bus system) to weekly “intercambio” language exchanges for practicing your blossoming Spanish with locals  to advice and assistance on booking tourist activities and trips.  One of the employees formerly led trips all over South America and is a great source of recommendations, and she’s more than happy to help you with as much of the booking/planning process as you want.  The school has a strong community vibe, and we really look forward to seeing the staff as well as the other students each morning when we arrive.

While we’re clearly very satisfied with our choice, there are plenty of good options in Buenos Aires.  Key things to think about when choosing your school:

  • Location: Morning rush hour sucks.  Especially if this is your vacation.  And especially if you haven’t been waking up to an alarm clock for a while – it’s a rough transition back to having a schedule.  Figure out how you’re going to get to and from the school and make sure you’re actually going to do it.
  • Volume of students: There are pros and cons here.  Fewer students generally means a more personalized experience.  It also means it might be harder to get a class together that’s at your level (becomes more of a problem as you get to more advanced levels).  We went with a smaller school, and it’s sometimes been a challenge for them to pair Ryan with compatible classmates.
  • General vibe: The schools vary a bit in terms of the type of environment and students they attract.  Some are definitely geared more toward backpackers or those who want a 1-2 week basics class, while others draw an older student group or people living in Buenos Aires for longer.  The vibe from the staff and the academic director are also good indicators of what a school is like, so pay attention to these.

All in, we think our 80/20 approach to finding a Spanish school was quite successful!  I went from not knowing how to introduce myself to telling stories in the past tense (which anybody who’s studied Spanish before knows is way more painful than it sounds), and still more to come.  Let the adventures in Spanish continue!!

Cost of living in Buenos Aires

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So, we’ve been looking into planning a 3-day trip to Bariloche for next weekend, but after determining that it would cost ~$400 USD each for round trip plane tickets we decided it was time to sit down and figure out exactly how much we’ve been spending since we got here.  Before I continue, it should be noted that the locals here all swear by the long distance bus system–apparently you can get executive class which has seats that lay flat and in addition to personal entertainment systems/movies, they feed you and give you free champagne.  Now, that all sounds great, and it’s definitely a lot cheaper (more like $50/each), but I don’t care how “comfortable” it is, it’s still a 22 hour bus ride.  Each way.

First Class Bus Seats Argentina

Now that I see it, I totally want to spend 22 consecutive hours in a seat like that...

So, after much discussion, we’ve decided that we are not going to spend 44 hours on a bus for a 3 day trip.

Aeron Chair Image

We used to spent 15+ hours a day in these kind of seats and no one brought us free champagne 🙁

So, we dug into our spending over the last month or so and our budget can basically be broken down into 4 broad categories (this may be a breach of the terms of our rehab–we made pivot tables):

  • Rent:  $1200/month

  • Spanish School:  ~$1220/month for the 2 of us

  • Food/random cash expenses:  ~$1200/month or $40/day for the 2 of us

  • Tours/other excursions outside of day to day living expenses:  Variable

    • 1)  Rent:  $1200/month (USD)

    We are now paying $1200/month on our 3-month contract.  This is large 1 bedroom apartment with 1.5 bathrooms in a nice part of Recoleta and is at a well discounted daily rate vs. shorter term rentals (e.g., this apt. is listed at $100/day or $600/week) and includes all utilities + internet + weekly maid service.   Depending on what neighborhoods you are willing to consider and how nice of a place you want you can get cheaper than this (or much more expensive).  There seem to be “budget” apartments that range from ~$900-$1200/month for a 1 bedroom and are pretty hit or miss in terms of quality and “Luxury” apartments which are more like $1800+/month at a monthly rate and are significantly nicer.  We are somewhere in between.
    If you’re trying to figure out how to rent an apartment down here, be sure to check out our post on How to Rent an Apartment in Buenos Aires

    Currency issues: Apartments are pretty much always priced in USD and most want cash, so don’t expect to benefit from exchange rate changes as the prices are pegged to the USD.

    Bottom line: We’re paying $1200/month, if we wanted to go cheap, we could have probably found an acceptable place for $1000/month, but it would likely be significantly worse than what we have.  So I’d say that we are on the low end of what we could be paying.  If you are here for a shorter time period, I’d budget $300-600/week–much better than hotels, but definitely not free.

    Relative to San Francisco prices: ~33% of what we were paying in San Francisco, though hard to be apples to apples as that was a 12+ month lease and unfurnished.

    2)  Spanish School:  ~$1220/month for the 2 of us or $610 each   (USD)

    We are attending Vamos Spanish for 20 hour/week intensive classes (and loving it–review to come).  They charge US$150/week per person and it’s usually 1-4 people in your class which is pretty awesome.  We looked at several other schools as well and the range seems to be $150-$200/week for 20 hours at the smaller schools, or you can go to the university where it is significantly cheaper, but much larger classes.

    Currency issues: Spanish schools generally price in USD, but most allow credit cards or PayPal payments.  Just don’t expect to benefit from exchange rate changes as the prices are pegged to the USD.

    Bottom line: If you’re going to do intensive spanish classes, you should plan on spending at least $150/week.  Can definitely get more expensive if you throw in private lessons which are more like $20/hour on average.  That said, it’s definitely our favorite part of being here and well worth the expense to learn such a valuable life skill.

    3)  Food/random cash expenses: ~$1200/month or ~$40/day for the 2 of us. (USD)

    This is by far the most volatile expense category for every day expenses and for us is easily 95+% food.  We generally eat in a restaurant for 1 meal a day, sometimes 2 and the rest of the time either cook at home or eat left-overs.  After our  first couple of weeks of eating out all the time, more lately we’ve  been averaging about $40/day (~AR$ 150).  Here’s how it breaks down by meal:

    Breakfast: Argentines aren’t that into breakfast.  A typical Argentine breakfast, if they bother eating in the morning, is a coffee and a couple of Medialunas (basically a combination of a croissant and a donut).  This will cost you ~AR$10-20 (~US$2.50-5.00) depending on where you get it.  If you really want to splurge, you might get a Tarta (individual quiche) for ~AR$22 pesos, but that’s about the sum of your breakfast options.  We generally eat cereal at home.

    Lunch: Restaurant lunch prices can vary significantly and will typically run you anywhere from AR$30-50 (US$8-15) per person.  There are 3 primary options:

    • Basic: If you want to go cheap, you can often find a basic sandwich for ~AR$20-25 + a drink for ~AR$5-10 bringing you to a total of AR$25-35 (US$6-10).
    • Menu del Dia: If you aren’t in the mood for a sandwich, most restaurants offer a ‘menu del dia” in which they’ll offer 2-3 options which usually include an appetizer + an entree + a dessert + a drink + a coffee for AR$30-40 (US$8-12).  Very good deal assuming you like what they are offering.  Quick tip:  The “Menu del Dia” is always written on a sign outside the front door of the restaurant and rarely reprinted on the menu itself.  So be sure to memorize the options before you go in!
    • A’la Carte: Basically the standard dinner prices which vary by restaurant, but are often in the range of AR$30-60 per entree and AR$20-30/starter or salad.  Basic drinks (soda, water, etc.) are usually ~AR$8, a beer will typically run ~AR$15 and a glass of wine is more like AR$18 for a solid pour.  Quick tip: Always order wine by the bottle–very often, 2 glasses of wine cost more than the same bottle and they are always very happy to package up a bottle that you didn’t finish for you to take with you.

    Dinner: Basically dinner is the same as the A’la Carte option from lunch.  Assuming we don’t go somewhere super fancy, we’ll usually order a bottle of wine + one starter + 2 entrees and that will run us ~AR$120-140 for 2 or AR$60-70 each (US$16-18 per person)  If we go to a nice place we’ll spend considerably more, that said, even at the nicest places we’ve probably maxed out at ~AR$300 (US$80) for the 2 of us–this is very expensive here, but keep in mind the same dinner would likely cost closer to double or triple that in San Francisco.

    Alternative lunch/dinner: We have become huge fans of empanadas and usually have empanada night at least twice a week.  You can usually get great empanadas for ~AR$4 each and it would be difficult to eat more than 3-4 of them each, so this is a very cheap dinner.  We usually buy a dozen and then have them for 2 meals and there are empanada joints everywhere.  Also, you can do the same with pizza, though it’s slightly more expensive and doesn’t offer quite the same quantity of food per peso as empanadas do.

    Grocery stores: We aren’t in love with the grocery stores here.  You can definitely eat cheaper if you cook at home assuming you have a decent enough kitchen and cooking utensils.  That said, as a short-term renter, it’s unlikely that you’ll want to stock up on all of the spices and other cooking supplies that you’d want in order to make something you’d actually enjoy eating (spices are very expensive and hard to find here).  Most packaged/processed food at the grocery store is relatively expensive and fresher food seems cheaper (e.g., ~US$5/lb for rib-eye steak, grass fed of course).

    Wine: We drink a lot of wine.  Wine is WAY cheaper here than it is in the US.  Most stores have wine ranging from ~AR$8 up to ~AR$100 per bottle with the bulk of the offerings in the $AR20-30 range.  We are now hooked on a AR$13.50 bottle (~US$4)  which is quite good (and we are picky).  Also, it’s great to try good wine in restaurants as there is only about a 10-20% mark-up vs. the 3x US mark-up.  We save A LOT of money on wine here (though ironically drink less now that we are not consultants…)

    Bottom Line: US$20/person is probably a decent estimate for what you’ll spend on average for food/drink.  That said, for our first week or 2 we were probably double that, so if you’re here for a short trip you’ll likely spend more.  You could definitely spend less if you put some effort into it, but we are certainly not splurging at US$20.  Way cheaper than San Francisco, but it does add up.

    4)  Tours/other excursions outside of day to day living expenses:  Entirely up to you

    Most things that cater to tourists are expensive and priced in dollars, so proceed at your own risk.

    In summary

    It more expensive here than we had heard.  Many friends who had visited even just a few years back enjoyed much lower prices–apparently prices have been increasing from 20-30%/year for the last several years.  That said, it’s still a very cheap place to visit/live on a relative basis.

    Here’s our average daily expense summary (keep in mind this is for the 2 of us):
    Daily USD   (peso)
    Rent               40      (154)
    School            41      (157)
    Food/wine   39      (149)
    Misc                 ?        (?)
    Total               120   (460)

    Hope this is helpful.  Happy to answer any questions!


    Grilled cheese, please

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    When I say grilled cheese, what comes to mind?  Maybe a gooey toasted sandwich on Wonder bread with melted Kraft singles . . . maybe a diner-style sandwich on a hearty country loaf with classic cheddar?  Ask for “grilled cheese” in Buenos Aires, and that’s exactly what you’ll get – a slab of grilled Provolone cheese locally called a “Provoleta”.    Yum.

    Grilled cheese (aka Provoleta) imageWe had heard about this enticing inclusion on the Argentina parrilla menu, otherwise dominated by beef, beef and more beef (and the token chicken or pork option).  Can we really order a massive piece of cheese that’s been sliced thick and thrown on the grill?  Seems so decadent and outrageous, but we figured that if we could quit our jobs, get married and move to the other hemisphere all in a matter of weeks, we should be able to handle this.  And turns out, we did just fine – a nice crust on the bottom and ooey gooey bubbling goodness on top – yum!  We’re not saying we’re going to order this as our main dish anytime soon . . . but on the other hand, we’re not saying we won’t either.

    Miranda: Top quality lunch at a great price!

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    Success!!  I think we’ve mentioned in some of our other posts that our dining experience in Buenos Aires has been a bit hit-or-miss thus far.  We’ve been to a few restaurants that are great, and just as many that are mediocre (as well as one or two we wouldn’t let our dog eat at, if we had one).

    Today, after a long morning of getting our heads back into Spanish class after a weekend off, we were starving and headed over to Palermo Hollywood to check out a Mexican restaurant we’d heard was good (Taco Box – it was closed, so we’ll have to give it a try another time).  By the time we walked the 30 minutes there from our school, we were starving and quickly ran into Miranda.  Every table on the sidewalk was full, and they had a decent lunch special, so we thought we’d check it out.

    Miranda entrance image

    Our server initially only gave us the regular menu (which didn’t include the special lunch set menu) – not sure if this is because he was trying to up-sell us or because it’s the only menu in English – we’re giving him the benefit of the doubt and assuming the latter.  Once we asked for the daily menu, it took us no time at all to choose from the multiple options offered (did I mention that we were starving?).  We each had impressive appetizers (yay chorizo!), big main plates (chicken and veggie skewers for me, steak sandwich for Ryan), drinks and coffees for 90 pesos (~$23 US), including tip.  Just to put that in perspective, one of the aforementioned restaurants we wouldn’t let our dog eat at cost us closer to 150 pesos (~$40 US) – granted, that was dinner, but Miranda was far better in terms of ambience, food quality and service.

    All in, Miranda is a winner in our book.  We’ll definitely be back again to take advantage of their great lunch deal and plan to put it in our dinner rotation as well!

    Tip for learning spanish #1: Take your wine home!

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    Perhaps the best tip ever:

    Podríamos tomar el vino para llevar?

    =

    Can we take the wine to go?

    And the answer… YES!!!

    Que Fantastico!!!

    Wine Bottle Image

    These probably cost only $2. Total. Viva!!

    Yes… in Argentina, you can order a super cheap yet awesome bottle of wine at a restaurant, drink half and then take the rest home for later.  We are building a large collection of half full bottles

    !Viva Argentina!